March 28, 2024

Crossed

Nov. 9, 2014
A Local Pastor and a Local Atheist Debate

Jesus: God Man or Good Man?

First, it is worth noting that no other major religious figure claimed to be God. Neither Abraham, Mohammed, nor Buddha ever made such claims. Only Jesus claimed to be God, and backed it up with eyewitness miracles to substantiate his claims.

Second, the famous "I Am" statement recorded in the gospels are multiple, clear claims of deity. The "I Am" statements are why the Jews accused Jesus of blasphemy and sought the death penalty at the hands of the Roman government. In John 14:6 Jesus didn’t say, "Follow my teachings and they will point you in the right way." Rather, Jesus said, "I AM the way, the truth and the life"¦" (John 14:6). Every Jew correctly knew that Jesus was making an unabashed claim of deity.

Finally, the late CS Lewis–a former atheist–captures the essence of the issue in his classic book, Mere Christianity: "I am trying here to prevent anyone from saying the foolish thing that people often say about Him: "˜I’m ready to accept Jesus as great moral teacher, but I don’t accept His claim to be God.’ That is the one thing we must not say! A man who was merely a man and said the sort of things Jesus said would not be a great moral teacher. He would either be a lunatic–on a level with the man who says he’s a poached egg–or else he would be the Devil of Hell. You must make your choice. But let us not come up with any patronizing nonsense about His being a great human teacher. He has not left that option open to us. He did not intend to."

I couldn’t have said it better.

As a non-theist, I find the concept of any type of god fantastic and contrived. Nonetheless, I allow for the possibility (not to be confused with acceptance) that a supernatural creator exists in some parallel universe beyond the reach of current technology. However, ascribing the title of "god" to a human being is simply a bridge too far.

Most faiths, including Christianity, Islam, Judaism, and the other 4,000 plus religions alive today have established belief in one or multiple gods. Notable exceptions include Buddhism and Unitarian Universalism. Those deities are generally "not of this world," which simplifies fabrications. Somehow, Jesus became the exception. To his followers, he is literally God. Since there is little verifiable history to confirm that this person even existed, believers take the ultimate leap of faith when adorning him with supernatural qualities.

I have always marveled at the ease with which the historical Jesus was elevated to paranormal status. He surely would not have asked for it, since all positive portrayals confer extreme humility. If he had known then how his future would evolve, he might have been more precise with the quotes that have been attributed to him.

I’m certain pastor Nick scoffs at my cynicism. However, as Richard Dawkins has stated, "We are all atheists about most of the gods that humanity has ever believed in. Some of us just go one god further." Some of us are even willing to stretch the god concept to include human beings. From what we know about Gandhi, Mother Theresa, Muhammad, Jesus, et al, they were wonderful human beings. It seems rational to leave it there. As I have always stated, believe what you want, but we must strive to keep those personal beliefs out of our public schools and government.

Gary’s Response

Eyewitness miracles? Really? Whose eyes? All of the gospels were collaborations from multiple authors at least 40 years after Jesus died (or if you prefer, floated up into heaven). The only confirmed written materials from 30 to 70 CE are the epistles of Paul from the 50s, with little mention of Jesus and none pertaining to miracles.

Anyone at any time can produce similar "I am" statements. They only have validity to those willing to accept the preposterous notion that they are historically accurate. I always wonder whom the fans of C.S. Lewis would turn to in his absence, since the supply of other learned atheist-turned-believers is so limited. Remember, his primary contribution to posterity was creating fiction.

Nick’s Response

Questioning the historical existence of Jesus is an age-old tactic. Jewish historian Josephus and Roman historian Tacitus acknowledged Jesus’ life and death, as do most atheists. The only real question is Jesus’ resurrection--upon which hangs the entire Christian faith.

As for Gary’s suggestion that Jesus was later elevated to God-like status that he never claimed–that’s nonsense (and I mean that in the most respectful way). A rudimentary understanding of Hebrew culture and language make it clear that Jesus’ has repeatedly attributed to himself God’s holiest name (Yahweh).

Was Jesus God? Yes. For evidence supporting both the deity and resurrection of Jesus, go to www.rzim.org and type in "Did Jesus rise from the dead?"

Where We Agree

Nick and Gary agree that the words attributed to Jesus from historical documents describe him as benevolent, altruistic, and generous. Both would like to see more of these traits exemplified within our current political leadership.

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